0:12

Hello there , welcome

0:15

to the World Cafe podcast

0:17

. This podcast has been designed

0:19

with created content that centers

0:22

on the power of words . Can

0:24

we really do anything without speaking

0:26

? Can we really do anything without

0:28

the agency of words ? Yes

0:31

, that is what this podcast

0:33

is all about , and I am your host

0:35

, amakri Isuboye

0:37

, your neighborhood word trader

0:40

. I believe in the power of

0:42

words , for it is

0:44

the unit of creation . I

0:46

trade in words to profit my

0:48

world . Good

0:52

morning , good

0:54

afternoon , good evening , good

0:56

, everything . Wherever

0:59

you are on the surface

1:01

of the earth at this very

1:04

instant listening to me , how

1:06

are you all doing ? Beautiful

1:09

? I will always ask

1:11

that question because it

1:13

means a lot to me . Yes

1:15

, thank God

1:17

, you are there . Thank God

1:19

I am here . We're

1:21

both within this space

1:23

. Yes , this

1:26

is the space where we come into , lean on one another's

1:28

experience to forge a positive path

1:30

. I'm grateful

1:33

. Yes , yes , yes , yes , yes , yes , it's

1:35

been a wonderful , wonderful time . Yep

1:38

, it's been a wonderful time

1:40

. A

1:43

lot has been going on . A

1:49

lot will always happen . Yes , you know that a lot will always happen . Yes , you

1:51

know that it will always happen , but the

1:53

truth is we live in this unique moment where there's

1:56

a lot of disruptions happening and

1:59

people's understanding

2:02

of reality , the perception

2:04

and all that has been redefined . And

2:07

it's like those who

2:09

know what it means to

2:12

evolve . You

2:14

know , in the sense of evolution now

2:16

, you know and live at

2:19

once . But I say those who understand the

2:21

future . You know , like living from the

2:23

future back to the future , kind

2:25

of thing . So it's been

2:27

that , it's been that , yep

2:30

, yes , I'm back , I'm back , I'm back

2:32

, I'm back . Did I ever leave ? Well

2:34

, so what are we going

2:36

to be doing today ? Well

2:39

, let

2:41

me give you a background . Yes

2:44

, what I came in to do today . Actually

2:46

, I want to talk about a person

2:49

, an individual , and

2:51

he's referred to as the maverick

2:53

Ricardo Semla . But

2:56

before I go into that , I want to give

2:58

you a background for

3:01

change management

3:04

. A lot

3:06

of us fight with it , we resist

3:08

it , we see

3:10

it from the negative . You

3:13

know like it's coming to take away

3:15

what we are used to , what we are

3:17

, what we know . This is how I

3:19

know how to do things . Why come and change it and

3:21

all of that . Like the Americans will say

3:23

if it's working , don't change it , and all of that

3:25

. Like the americans will say if he's working , don't change it , and all of that

3:27

. So it brings this fear . But when you

3:29

look at the world , the globe , the

3:32

earth , things that we

3:34

see happen , one

3:36

thing that defines our reality

3:38

is

3:40

work . Yes , be

3:43

it . Look at it from the very

3:46

beginning of work

3:48

. You know what we know work to be from

3:50

the ancient and what have you

3:52

. So today we now have the corporate

3:54

space , what we call corporate space . You

3:57

know , work has been defined by

3:59

corporations and somehow

4:02

they shift

4:04

and shape our lives and

4:07

people get excited . You know , I

4:09

work with this organization , I work with that

4:11

corporation and all that , and I've

4:13

come to define the way I

4:15

see , uh , organizations

4:18

and corporations , the way I see them

4:20

, I define them as the

4:23

architect

4:25

of I beg your pardon the

4:27

architecture of organizations . I mean designed

4:30

in such a way that

4:33

they provide a platform

4:35

for people to self-actualize

4:37

. That's the way I see it . You

4:40

work in an organization , you want to be

4:42

. You hear about the vision and the mission and all of that . It excites

4:45

you and you want to be . You know you hear about a vision and a mission and all of that it excites you and you want to

4:47

be part of it . So you see , it's like

4:49

you're standing on the platform that

4:51

has given you the latitude to like

4:53

express yourself yes , I'm

4:55

an engineer or I'm an analyst

4:58

or whatever . So they give you

5:00

all the support , provide

5:02

all the resources and

5:04

somehow this is on the basis of profitability

5:07

yes , you make

5:09

profit for the organization and

5:11

the organization also brings somehow

5:14

profit into your life . All of this

5:16

put together comes

5:18

to define the way we do things

5:21

and sometimes , if not most

5:23

of the times , organizations now

5:25

, or corporations kind of hold

5:27

this what I call it God-like

5:30

position in the society and

5:33

they define things , they do things

5:35

and you hear in

5:38

organizations like well , this

5:40

is what the company wants . And sometimes

5:42

you ask yourself is the company an

5:44

abstract , like something

5:46

, a distant entity somewhere

5:49

? Or the company is a group of

5:51

people where you now have stuff

5:53

and all of that ? So I

5:57

remember doing this course by

6:00

post-grad with Diplomary or

6:03

Global Human Resources Management

6:05

, and one of the modules

6:07

we talked about

6:10

it had to do about , I think it talked about

6:12

the democracy in

6:15

organizations and one name that

6:17

popped up that we studied was

6:19

Ricardo Semla , and I think he did

6:21

a book , the Maverick . So

6:23

before I go into anything about I

6:26

, have some stuff , some information I want to share

6:28

with you in terms of I'm going to read and

6:30

interject , say one or two things you

6:32

know , but I want us to

6:34

start from this point of the meaning

6:37

of the word maverick . Maverick

6:41

, this is what I've come to see from

6:44

the word human being , as in

6:46

human being , we

6:48

are beings who are humors

6:51

or that dwell

6:53

in a body . Get my thought . What

6:56

precedes ? Is it humanity

6:58

or being ? You

7:00

understand me . When you be

7:03

or when you become , or when

7:05

you embrace your being , you

7:07

will become . This

7:09

is what I'm driving at . Your

7:12

activity is

7:14

dependent on your doing

7:16

, as in your being , who

7:20

you are , the things

7:22

you do are

7:24

dependent or premised

7:27

on your being . When

7:30

you call somebody a thief , why

7:33

he or she is

7:37

putting up an attitude that

7:40

defines that whatever

7:43

. So , maverick , the

7:46

word maverick comes from Samuel

7:48

Maverick . It's somebody's name . Yes

7:51

, maverick is somebody's name the

7:53

Texas cattle rancher in the 1800s

7:56

. He refused to brand

7:58

his cattle Like

8:00

. This is the practice there . He refused it

8:02

. This was unorthodox at

8:04

the time and led to people

8:07

calling unbranded

8:09

cattle maverick and

8:12

calling people who don't follow

8:14

the rules maverick

8:16

, like when you watch . What

8:19

was the name of that movie now ? The one

8:21

by Tom Hanks that

8:23

had to do with flights

8:25

. Somebody remind me ? Now Let me remind

8:28

me , remind me , yes , I know you know what I'm talking

8:30

about . Tom Cruise . Did that movie

8:32

, tom

8:34

Cruise ? Hold on , let

8:37

me get that information . Tom Cruise

8:39

, the Maverick I

8:42

need to get the name actually Mm-hmm . Yep , in that movie Top Gun yes

8:44

, top Gun . They call him the Maverick . I need to get

8:46

the name actually . In that movie , top Gun yes , top

8:48

Gun they called him the Maverick . Now , he was

8:50

called the Maverick because he

8:53

didn't follow rules . If you remember

8:55

one of the scenes in Top Gun

8:57

, part 2 , when

9:02

they called him to train the Navy pilots , they

9:05

had an activity to take care of . They

9:07

called him and he just came into the room

9:09

, picked up the materials , threw

9:11

all of them into a dustbin

9:13

and said well , you don't need them . Why

9:16

I wrote them ? So

9:19

I'm here myself to teach you . So they were all taken aback , so

9:21

that you know an individual

9:24

who doesn't follow rules , like why should we

9:26

? And all of that , he's a maverick . So

9:28

the corporate space has

9:31

been defined by certain rules

9:33

. But this

9:37

individual , ricardo

9:40

Semler the maverick

9:42

, as they call him came in and

9:45

did he changed

9:47

a lot of things . You know

9:49

, if you Harvard Business

9:51

School had to like , you know , they carried out a study

9:53

about him and

9:56

his style . All

9:58

right , then , I'm going to do some reading now , give

10:01

you some information about Ricardo

10:03

Semla and why he's called the maverick

10:06

, and what he did to change

10:08

the landscape , the corporate landscape

10:11

, you know , globally speaking , even

10:13

though a lot of people , so many corporations

10:15

, fight his thoughts

10:18

and his approach and all

10:20

of that . But for crying out loud , why

10:23

change it if it's working

10:25

? So he was born in 1959

10:28

. That's Ricardo Semler , the chief

10:30

executive officer and majority owner

10:32

of Semco Partners , a

10:35

Brazilian company best known for its

10:37

radical form of industrial

10:40

democracy and

10:43

corporate re-engineering industrial democracy

10:45

and corporate re-engineering . Under his ownership , revenue

10:47

has grown from $4 million in 1982

10:51

to $212

10:54

million in 2003

10:57

. That's a huge jump , and

10:59

his business management policies have attracted

11:02

widespread interest around the

11:04

world . Time featured him in

11:06

its Global 100 Young Leaders

11:09

Profile series , published in 1994

11:13

. While the World Economic Forum also

11:15

nominated him , the Wall Street

11:17

Journal's Latin

11:19

America magazine named him Latin

11:22

America Businessman of the Year in 1990

11:24

, and he was named Brazilian

11:27

Businessman in the year

11:29

1990 and 1992

11:32

. That's a long word , a Spanish word Virando

11:37

a Profer mesa

11:40

turning your own table

11:42

that's the interpretation . His

11:44

first book became the best-selling

11:46

non-fiction book in the history

11:49

of Brazil . He has since

11:52

written two books in English and On

11:55

the transformation

11:57

of SEMCO and workplace

11:59

re-engineering . Maverick

12:01

, an English version of Turning

12:03

your Own Table published

12:06

in 1993 , and

12:08

an international bestseller

12:11

and the seven-day weekend

12:13

in 2003 . Now let's

12:15

have some background about this individual

12:18

. You know Semla went to work for

12:20

his father's company , originally called

12:22

Semler and Company , then

12:24

as mixer and agitator

12:27

supplier in

12:29

Sao Paulo in Brazil . Semler

12:32

clashed with his own father

12:34

, antonio Semler , who

12:36

you know supported a traditional

12:39

autocratic style of management

12:42

you know the top-down approach

12:44

, whereas young Semler favored

12:46

a decentralized , participatory

12:49

style . So you

12:52

know this is a traditional . You know

12:54

the pyramid that's how I

12:56

describe it the pyramidal thinking

12:58

or the pyramidal structure where

13:00

you have that authority

13:04

ego up there and

13:07

everybody seemed to like do

13:09

we're doing the bidding of the

13:11

boss and nobody questions

13:13

? Nobody , it's not participatory

13:16

, you don't ask questions , you just

13:18

do as you're told . So he had so

13:20

much . I mean issues with his

13:22

father , ricardo . I

13:24

mean favored diversification

13:27

away from the struggling shipbuilding

13:31

industry which his

13:33

father opposed . Obviously

13:35

, you know the father did not like his approach

13:38

. Obviously , you know the father did not like his approach . After heated

13:40

clashes the son threatened to leave

13:42

the company . Rather than see this

13:45

happen , antonio

13:47

, the father , antonio Semler

13:50

, resigned as CEO and vested majority

13:52

ownership in his son . In 1980

13:55

, when Ricardo was 21 years

13:57

old , on his

13:59

first day as CEO , ricardo

14:07

Sembler fired 60% of

14:09

all top managers . He fired them , I

14:11

mean maybe those who were working with

14:13

his father and were not ready for change , to embrace and

14:15

all that , he began to work on a

14:17

diversification program to

14:20

rescue the company . So

14:23

Semla experienced health issues , culminating

14:25

in a fainting spell , you

14:27

know , at a pump factory , ah

14:30

yes . So when he was 25

14:33

, after seeing a doctor

14:35

at the Lahey Clinic , as

14:37

in Boston , he was diagnosed with

14:39

an advanced case of stress

14:41

. This inspired him to want

14:44

a greater work-life balance

14:46

to himself and his

14:48

employees . So attempts to introduce

14:51

a matrix organizational structure

14:53

in 1988 failed to achieve

14:55

desired improvements . So in the late

14:57

1980s , three

14:59

engineers at SEMCO proposed setting

15:02

up a nucleus of technological

15:05

innovation , that's NTI , to

15:07

develop new businesses and

15:09

product lines , which

15:12

Semla endorsed . He

15:14

said no problem , ricardo , I agree to it . So

15:16

at the end of the first six

15:18

months , the NTI , that's the

15:20

nucleus of technological Innovation

15:23

, had identified

15:25

18 such opportunities

15:28

. Following the success

15:30

of this initiative , satellite

15:33

units were encouraged throughout

15:35

Semco . By the late

15:37

1980s , these satellite

15:40

units , you know , accounted

15:42

for two-thirds of its new products

15:45

and two-thirds of its employees

15:47

. Hmm , amazing . An

15:50

assessment of Semla's business philosophy

15:52

through a neurological

15:55

analysis , with a radical

15:57

change of Semco's management style , led

16:00

Bombalala to conclude

16:02

Bambala , I think , is a writer that it

16:04

was an excellent exemplification

16:08

of good leadership . A

16:11

learner glow notes that the

16:13

only accounts

16:15

about the change in

16:17

management style come from Ricardo

16:20

Semler himself rather than

16:22

from the effect of the workers

16:24

. Yes , his perception . So

16:26

, after those dramatic restrictions

16:29

on liquidity instituted

16:31

, as we're still reading now , by

16:33

Brazilian President Fernando

16:36

Collor del Melo to combat

16:38

hyperinflation in 1990

16:40

. The Brazilian economy went

16:42

into a severe downturn , forcing

16:45

many companies to declare

16:47

bankruptcy . So workers at

16:50

SEMCO agreed to wage

16:52

cuts . When we're doing this course , this particular

16:54

aspect , when

16:56

we got to this point , he

16:59

called for a meeting . Yes , ricardo

17:02

himself . He laid out the cards

17:04

before them that this is where we are and

17:06

this is what is going to happen . What I mean he called , he

17:08

called the whole company , be

17:11

it a janitor , be

17:13

it an analyst

17:15

, be it whatever . He got at

17:17

everybody . This is what is happening in brazil

17:20

. So , and if we don't

17:22

take certain steps , we

17:25

are going to go under and somehow

17:27

he , I think , if I , if I

17:29

remember correctly the story , you

17:31

know then the material we , we

17:34

used . He was like I've known these

17:36

people all my life , we

17:38

grew up together and all of that . How do I

17:40

let them go ? How do I just , you know , and all that

17:42

, we need to do something . So he let

17:44

them know like , see , we need to do something . And

17:46

they all agreed for

17:49

a pay cut . As in it

17:51

was a democracy , more or

17:53

less . They all agreed , providing their shares

17:55

of profits was increased

17:58

to 39% , management

18:00

salaries were cut by 40% and

18:02

employees were given the right to

18:05

approve every item of expenditure

18:07

. That is recognizing

18:10

you are part of this system

18:12

, as in the big picture , you

18:14

are not just an employee who

18:16

is earning salary , that you are

18:18

part of this organization in terms of the growth

18:21

, the decision making and all of that

18:23

. So performing multiple roles during

18:25

the crisis gave workers greater knowledge

18:28

of the operations

18:30

and more suggestions on

18:32

how to improve the business . So

18:34

reforms implemented during

18:37

that time led to a 65%

18:40

reduction in inventories

18:43

. Can you imagine that ? A marked reduction

18:45

in product delivery times and a

18:47

product effect rate that fell

18:49

to less than 1%

18:52

. People became like

18:54

they look at the bigger

18:56

picture . I'm seeing myself the

18:59

bigger picture . So , as the business climate

19:02

improved , semco's revenue and

19:04

profitability improved dramatically

19:07

. So , as of 2003

19:10

, semco had annual revenue of $212

19:14

million , up from $4 million in 1982

19:17

and $35 million

19:19

in 1994 , with an annual

19:21

growth rate of up to 40%

19:24

a year . It employed 3,000

19:27

workers in 2003 , as

19:29

opposed to 90 in 1982

19:32

. The company's units include

19:34

the Industrial Nationary Unit

19:36

, which now manufactures mixing

19:38

equipment as opposed to pumps

19:40

, sembobac

19:43

, a partnership

19:45

with Baltimore Air Cooler . So

19:47

they're just giving you all what

19:50

I call it now what they have

19:52

in their portfolio , and

19:55

all of that call it now what they have in

19:57

their portfolio . And all of that . So as Semko grew , ricardo Semner

19:59

received a great deal

20:01

of recognition . He was named

20:03

Brazilian businessman of the year in 1990

20:06

and in 1992 . And the World

20:08

Economic Forum named him one of the global

20:11

leaders of tomorrow . Leaders

20:14

of tomorrow . A high-profile committee

20:16

appointed by CIO Magazine , featuring Tom Peters

20:19

, jim

20:21

Champy and

20:24

Michael Hammer , selected

20:26

Semco as one of the most successful

20:29

re-engineered companies in the

20:31

world . It's in Brazil , it's not in

20:33

the US , it's not in Europe

20:36

, it's in brazil . The

20:38

bbc included semco

20:40

in the series of re-engineering

20:42

the business for creating one of

20:45

the most successful management

20:47

structures in business guys

20:50

. Now

20:53

, okay

20:55

, let me read some more , then we'll come into the discussions

20:58

. Semla has reduced

21:00

his involvement in Semco in the past

21:02

decade to pursue other

21:04

activities . He wrote a book Maverick

21:07

yes , it's out there on his experience

21:09

at Semco , which became a worldwide bestseller

21:12

in 1993 . Became a worldwide

21:14

bestseller in 1993

21:17

. His

21:22

second book , the Seven Day Weekend , changing the Way Walks , was published in 2003

21:24

. He has appeared in the media around the world and speaks

21:26

regularly to

21:28

business schools , businesses

21:30

and groups to promote his philosophy

21:33

of industrial democracy . He

21:35

has also been a visiting scholar

21:37

at Harvard Business School . Yay

21:41

Semla has been vice

21:43

president of the Federation of Industries

21:46

of Brazil and a member of SOS

21:49

Atlantic Forest , the

21:51

leading environmental defense organization

21:53

in Brazil . He founded the

21:55

Rastro Semla Foundation

21:58

and the Lumiere School

22:00

, a democratic school where children

22:02

from 0 to 14 years old engage

22:05

in projects of their interest

22:07

. There are three such schools

22:09

one in the city of Sao Paulo and

22:11

two in the vicinity of

22:14

Campos do Jardal that's a Latin I mean a Portuguese

22:16

word now and two in the vicinity of Campos do Jardal that's

22:18

a Latin , I mean a Portuguese word now

22:20

in the state of Sao Paulo

22:22

. Now

22:28

, you will agree with me . This is not common

22:30

. The time we did this course

22:33

and I read about it , it stuck

22:35

with me . I

22:40

always share it with my wife , share it with whoever

22:42

cares to listen . He

22:46

looked at the business

22:48

, what I say , the industry , the landscape , differently . Yes , did he have challenges ? Of course

22:50

he did . But he

22:52

stuck to his conviction

22:54

and looked at the

22:57

definition , how leadership

23:00

, business leadership was defined and how they were

23:03

doing things . And he's like we

23:05

can do something different , we can do it differently

23:07

. And

23:12

he brought his own definition . One

23:15

thing I've come to understand for an organization to thrive and do very well , two things are very

23:17

important culture and people , or

23:20

people and culture . Culture

23:22

and people or people and culture

23:25

. And again you have this you

23:27

know , organizations don't operate

23:29

in empty

23:31

spaces . No , they

23:34

don't . Organizations don't operate

23:36

in another planet or another

23:38

climate or something . They operate

23:40

within a given geography and

23:43

the over should

23:46

I say whelming cultural practices

23:49

. In that geography has

23:51

a lot . It puts so much pressure

23:53

on the whole organizational

23:56

culture , whether you want to believe it or not

23:58

, because from what we read now , ricardo's

24:00

father , antonio , he's

24:02

more of that . You know , old

24:05

school , we may want to call it what's

24:09

the right word , now Let me call it correctly

24:11

so that I don't muddle

24:13

it up . He's more of

24:15

the autocratic yes , like

24:18

top down . And

24:20

you know , if you look at the brazilian uh

24:23

culture , there's

24:25

a lot . If you study brazil so

24:27

well , you come to see that he's

24:29

in latin america . Uh , you

24:31

would see , is he , he Latin American

24:34

? Okay , they speak Portuguese there

24:36

. So you would see that slave

24:39

, the slave

24:42

culture . And

24:44

he said it's there , it's heavily there

24:46

, where the boss speaks

24:49

and everybody follows that . He

24:52

fought against it . He was

24:54

like we can be better , the

24:57

individuals , the people who work for

24:59

us , as it were , or with

25:01

us . If we let them have

25:04

that ownership mindset , it

25:07

will be a question of you park

25:09

this car at your own risk , like

25:11

you see in car parks , this

25:14

car is parked at owner's risk , so

25:18

the organization belongs to all of us . And so he

25:20

drove the process and today somehow

25:23

they call him the maverick

25:25

. I

25:29

will tell you from my own

25:31

observation there's been a lot of

25:33

change I keep saying it in

25:35

the past two , three , four episodes

25:38

A lot of change . Changes

25:41

have been going on . Things

25:43

are happening Economic downturn

25:45

, crunch , here and there there's

25:48

a redefinition . There's

25:50

a redefinition from

25:53

from where I stand and where I see you

25:55

. You know you , you notice that a

25:58

group of people who have

26:00

the economic or political

26:02

will can come together

26:04

to define the cost of

26:07

people , that

26:09

when you look at that definition , it may not really

26:11

be in the interest of everybody

26:13

. And I think that's where he

26:15

came from . He

26:18

looked at it . What do you think if you

26:20

own a piece ? What

26:23

do you think if you own a piece ? Imagine

26:27

if you own a piece of the world , the earth . You

26:29

own it , like literally , you own it

26:31

, a piece of it . How

26:34

would you want it to function ? How

26:37

would you want it to ? You know , and

26:40

you come to look at it , all of us own

26:43

a piece . It's

26:45

a question of you taking a piece to

26:47

pray for the peace . It's

26:50

a question of taking a piece to pray for

26:52

the development . It's a question of taking

26:54

the piece and looking at it like

26:56

, wow , if

27:00

my piece or my portion works

27:03

and I've put it in

27:06

like a piece of a puzzle , I mean

27:08

a piece into that puzzle and it fits

27:10

and the picture comes out . Can

27:14

you imagine that for a minute ? So

27:17

a lot of business owners , top

27:20

leaders , you know

27:22

, in the business space they

27:25

have a lot , yes

27:27

, reengineering

27:29

to do , a lot of reengineering

27:31

to do . Yeah

27:34

, technology has brought a lot

27:36

of advancement . Yes , but policies

27:38

are still there . So how

27:40

do we go about it ? Is it

27:42

going to be the pyramidal thinking

27:44

, top-down approach , where

27:48

people are

27:50

not seen for who they are and

27:52

what they can bring in

27:54

the upliftment or

27:57

development ? Because the

27:59

truth is , every geography

28:01

on which organizations

28:04

are built , if

28:06

the geography improves

28:09

, the organization also will improve

28:11

. If the organization

28:14

does not improve , likely

28:17

the geography is not improving because

28:20

the geography feeds

28:22

into the organization and not the other way around

28:24

. That's my

28:27

belief , that's my conviction . You

28:29

don't try to segment it in such a way that

28:31

, yes , this

28:33

organization has a culture

28:35

, no

28:40

, the overacting , prevailing culture puts a lot of pressure on

28:42

the organizational culture and you see

28:44

it play out . But

28:46

if we are as individuals , come

28:48

together individuals I mean now

28:50

decision makers , policy makers and

28:54

see that we can actually change

28:56

things

28:58

for

29:00

the overall good . That's

29:04

the story of Ricardo Semler , the

29:06

maverick . All right , guys

29:08

, this is what I came to do today on

29:10

the show , just to share with us that

29:13

we can actually make that change in

29:15

our organizations , decision leaders

29:18

and all that . And

29:20

let me use this opportunity to say

29:23

this out there . I've been

29:25

meaning to have Ricardo Semler

29:27

, himself the maverick , on my show

29:29

. I've tried to do one

29:31

or two reading about him

29:33

, to reach out . If you hear this

29:35

and you know him , or you know somebody

29:37

who knows him well , just

29:39

tell him . The World Cafe Podcast

29:41

would love to have him . You

29:44

know , come , share with us . You know firsthand

29:46

information about , you

29:49

know this democratic

29:51

re-engineering , industrial

29:53

democracy , so to say , and

29:55

I mean to share with my audience . Please let

29:58

this word get to him . So , guys

30:00

, this is what I came to do today . Yes , guys

30:03

, be a maverick . Yes

30:05

, sometimes you may not be understood , but

30:07

, hello , do

30:10

you understand yourself ? Yeah

30:14

, so do it , go ahead , do it , go ahead

30:17

, do it as

30:19

, in the light of good and

30:21

truth , you understand me

30:23

. So you do it and you're just like

30:25

okay , fine , this is my contribution

30:27

. All right , guys , thank

30:29

you so much . Thank you so much . It's always

30:31

a pleasure for me to come in , you

30:34

know , to share with you and all

30:36

of that . I want to make this appeal If

30:38

you're listening to me at this very moment

30:41

, go ahead and share the

30:43

World Cafe , what we do here , with

30:45

your friends , family and all

30:47

of that . It means a lot to me , you

30:49

know , and I

30:51

know this is my own way

30:53

of contributing Yep , from

30:56

my geography . Thank

30:58

you so much . It's always a pleasure

31:00

coming in sitting down here and

31:02

speaking with you . Okay , guys

31:04

, you know how we do it on the show . This

31:08

is a place where we come into , lean on one

31:11

another's experience to forge a positive

31:13

path . I hope this positivity

31:16

is getting to you All

31:18

. Right , then , till I come your way again . You know

31:20

how we say it on the show . Bye

31:23

for now . Awesome

31:31

time it has been with you on the World Cafe

31:33

podcast today . Thank you for

31:36

being there . You can catch me up

31:38

on my social media handles Twitter

31:40

, Facebook , linkedin and Instagram

31:42

, all at Amakri Isoboye

31:44

. Also , you can get copies of

31:46

my books A Cocktail of Words

31:49

, the Color of Words by

31:51

H Aaron Notebook and Hocus

31:53

Pocus on God on Amazon

31:56

and Roving Heights online

31:58

bookstores . You can also subscribe

32:00

to my YouTube channel at the

32:02

same address at Amakri

32:04

Issawe . I love to hear

32:06

from you and how this podcast

32:08

has impacted you . You

32:11

can leave me a message at my email

32:13

address at macrigaribaldi

32:15

at gmailcom . That

32:17

is A-M-A-C-H-R-E-E-E-G-A-R-I-B-A-L-D-I

32:24

. Yes , till

32:26

I come your way again . Bye

32:29

for now , you .